In Spinners End, when Bella was arguing with Snape about who Voldemort trusted, she said " That was not my fault!" said Bellatrix, flushing. "The Dark Lord has, in the past, entrusted me with his most precious___ if Lucious hadn't___" What was that precious something? I don't think it was the diary. Any ideas anyone?

i actually thought the diary was a possibility, but she could be exaggarating- i get the impression she sees herself as LV's most trusted DE, so she could have been saying that to empthasise that she is 'close' to LV

No, I think Bella very nearly shared something she wasn't meant to, so I think she had a horcrux in her care at one point, or knows where one of the horcruxes is.

I was logging on today to discuss this exact issue...

I think it was the diary.

And the whole character of Bella needs to be explored more. She is very unique.

Twisted, Fanatical, and evil - but, you have to hand it to her - she IS loyal to LV, not just hungry for power or protection or status - Bella is a real believer in LV. Her stint to Azkeban proved it. That makes her the most dangerous of the Death Eaters. That was why she was worth saving by LV when he fled the ministry.

Any other thoughts on this character ? - she is not your run of the mill henchmen like those on deck at the lightening struck tower....

Agreed completely. Bellatrix is with LV to the very end. And that does make her the most dangerous. She's almost a zealot.

What I am wondering, is if she was implying that by Lucius using the diary as he did, he was responsible for tipping off DD about Voldemorts Horcruxes. Because the diary is really what brought up the whole idea of Voldemort actually having the Horcruxes in the first place, yes?

When I first read this I did wonder if she was referring to a Horcrux but I can't really see LV broadcasting to ANYONE that he has made Horcruxes let alone let them know if they have one in their possesion. Remember this is the key to his destruction and DE's have been know to switch sides or be captured and reveal secrets so why let something which he treasures above anything else (his immortality) be widely broadcast? I came to the conclusion that she was going to say something along the lines of 'he trusted me with his most precious secrets'

I have to admit I believe Bellatrix will be pivitol in book 7 and is a dangerous character to look out for. Then again I also feel that Narcissa could be a danger if she felt she had to protect Draco but I haven't made my mind up as to which side.

Didn't Voldemort give the diary directly to Malfoy though? The way Bella put it, whatever it was, he gave her before his downfall and her going to Azkaban. The way Narcissa shushed her about Malfoy... maybe I need to re-read the part in GoF where Harry sees her in the pensive. That part in HBP was just so over looked, it made me look again.

I think Bella is a very dangerous DE. she will gone down in flames before turning on LV. Will Snape stand up for harry when he needs help. I do think Snape and Bella do truly hate one another. But I do think Snape is on the good side of things. And that he must fight bella in the end.

Oh I like the idea of Snape and Bellatrix fighting in book seven!! I had almost liked the idea of Neville finishing Bellatrix off but I just get this horrid fear that she would just destroy him, I mean look at what she was able to do to his parents!! But Snape and Bellatrix!! Fabulous! You can tell the intense hatred between them in HBP (and JKR had to include the hatred for some reason) so they would both 'flare up' with hatred of each other and Snape is far more powerful the Neville so would give Bellatrix what she deserved. Plus if one or the other has to die at the hand of Bellatrix I would rather it be Snape than Neville!

I doubt the DE know about the horcruxes. I think Snape figured it out though but I don't see Voldemort telling thugs how to destroy him, which is what he would be doing by telling them about the horcruxes.

You know i have thought about it and her argument with snape is very telling. I mean you see it in stories and movies all the time where the boss (LV) is trusting, but one of the evil henchmen (Bella) figures out someone in their midst is actually a traitor. I think the fact that Bella is questioning snape is very telling that Snape might not have been as careful about his cover for her to even question it.

I doubt very seriously they know about it too. Didn't DD say something about if Lucius would have realized what he had in his possession he would have treated it more delicately than to use it for his own personal gain?

I don't think any of the DE or LV for that matter that DD had any idea about his horcruxes. Yet anyway..lol.

Hi! I am new to this site and have spent the better half of the day reading posts. I have a few theories, which may have been presented at one time or another. Is is possible that Bellatrix and LV had a child? Bellatrix almost lets slip that she was trusted with his "most precious...".

On a different but related note, I have a question about horcruxes. It is defined as the soul splitting when a most evil act is performed. Does this mean the soul splits in two? If so, if LV performed six different murders at different times, wouldn't that mean that each horcrux in succession is decreased in size than the one before?

Forgive me if this is nonsense.

Hi and

Firstly - yes the conclusion most people have come to is that each sucessive horcrux had less and less of LV's soul in it and the diary was the largest piece of soul in existence.

As for could Bellatrix and LV had a child the answer is no. this question was put to Jo at the World Book Day Chat in 2004 (full interview can be read here)



So sorry but a good idea though!

Knig2837 Great mathematical catch there! I never before thought of that but it makes sense to me. If we follow mathematical reasoning than the first horcrux that Voldemort created would contain 50% of his original soul. The second horcrux would only contain 25% of his original soul because he only had 50% soul left in his body to spilt for the second horcrux. That would mean that when he created his sixth horcrux the sixth horcrux would only contain 1.5625% of his original soul. But 1.5625% of pure evil is still pure evil. We know all six horcruxes must be destroyed before the 7th piece of soul (1.5625% of his original soul) that is actually left in his body is destroyed culminating in his death and destruction.
I definitely think that Bellatrix has a part to play in Book 7. I think because she is such a zealous follow of Voldemort that he uses her to his advantage. I believe he leads her into believing that she is very cherished and valued by him which will cause her to be a powerful weapon at his disposal. I think it was his manipulation of her that is behind her comment of him trusting her with his most precious...(whatever?)
I, too, am hoping that it is Neville who finishes her off but it would be quite fun to see her and Snape duke it out! Maybe Snape will disarm her and let Neville extract justice for his parents.
On a side note, does anyone else believe JKR may be foreshadowing a future event in Book 7 with the description of Bellatrix killing the fox when her and Narcissa arrive at Spinner's End?

Please, remember that the topic of this thread is "Bellatrix What was that precious ?" and not Horcruxes (you can discuss them here). I would be grateful if you stayed on topic. Thank you so much!

LL mod
You_won't_know_who

I wonder if Malfoy was in some way responsible for Bella getting caught and going to Azkaban. I'm thinking of the time frame and what they were doing when they got caught. Voldemort had already been vaporized and the DE, Belle and company, were torturing the Longbottoms trying to find Voldemort. I wonder if she had Voldemorts wand? The most precious things to Voldemort are his immortality, power, his revenge on... people in general for being inferior, then his wand and that snake. Ok, that raises a second question. Why would he give Lucius the diary? He didn't know about his future downfall, he thought he was going to stop it. Why would he give it to anyone knowing it had a bit of his soul in it? Whatever he gave Bella was not a horcrux I don't think but something he valued just as much. But it couldn't be the wand either, he didn't entrust that to anyone, it was picked up at the Potters house by someone and kept for him. I wonder where he lived during his reign as the Dark Lord. Some place unplottable for sure. I wonder if Bella was his house secret keeper.. his most precious whereabouts? Maybe that's why he had to split to Albania? Oh! What if he was using the Black house? Sirius never went there, the parents were dead already, I'm assuming, Bella is a Black relative and would have access to it I would think and the Black house was highly unplottable. Back to the books.....

Actually that's quite likely, but why did LV abandon it before the order moved in, and why weren't there clues left in the house? (or were there, and we overlooked them?)

I always thought that 'he intrusted me with his most precious, if lucius hadn't-' referred to the incident in the ministry in OotP. He entrusted her with the task of getting the prophecy, but Lucius as the leader messed it up. But it could also have been something to do with the diary horcrux?

Possibly Bella discovered about it (she is a very good occlumens and has been teaching Draco Malfoy) then perhaps LV trusted her to keep quiet about it, but Lucius gave it to Ginny and it got destroyed.

Well, there's clues throughout the series that we've over looked till something made us go back and take notice of it, which is what I think JKR intended. What you say about the ministry mess up is a good theory, that makes sense, but I get the impression that it might be something earlier in the series. Thinking back, does Lucius seem like the type that would want to take over as Dark Lord to you? I was pondering how little Voldemort reprimanded him for some things when he was harsh on others. Remember when Lucius was in Borgins trying to get rid of a few things in his house that he didn't want the ministry to fine? I wonder if maybe Bella was a secret keeper for Voldemort and Lucius forced her into switching it to him, then maybe Lucius was responsible for Bella and her husband and brother in law getting caught by the aurors and sent to Azkaban. Then if Lucius raided Voldemorts house and stole some things, if he has something Voldemort holds precious, it could be why Voldemort was easier on Lucius. Then Lucius getting thrown into Azkaban, Voldemorts using Draco and putting him in harms way could be a clear message to Lucius to return or tell where the precious something is. I've been going over OotP and making note of everything mentioned. But, would Dumbledore think to scour the Black house for signs of Voldemort? I don't know... I just know I'm missing something very relevant and Bella's remark is a clue.

One thing clear from Spinners end discussion to me is that each high ranking DE seems to think they are closer to LV than any of the others.

And while LV would not reveal the nature of "horcruxes," he may have in a quiet and intimate moment with his top and most trusted cronies trusted a few of them with "his most precious..."

For Malfoy, it was his diary. For Bella, maybe it is a cup, or knowledge of the location of the Locket (that could be a reason why Regulus got tipped off about it and was able to put two and two together - he followed cousin Bella on a security visit?)

In any case, the "precious" statement left just hanging there is electric with such speculations - great theory.

(as a side note, and I noted this in the referenced thread somewhere in the past - I do not hold to the percent split theory as described in this thread - I would suggest something more psychological - like multiple personalities - let me know if you want a link to that discussion and I will post it for reference outside this thread.)

In one very compelling theory, the “precious” Bellatrix referred to is the Slytherin locket Horcrux that Voldemort gave her to hide in the cave, but Regulus switched the locket before Bellatrix placed it in the cave.

So the meaning of Bellatrix’s remark:

“The Dark Lord has, in the past, entrusted me with his most precious—if Lucius hadn’t—“ HBP2

would be that she was entrusted with hiding the Slytherin locket in the cave just as Lucius had been entrusted with keeping the diary for safekeeping. Lucius hadn’t been told that it was a Horcrux when it was given to him, but perhaps found out or guessed that it was when Voldemort became enraged after learning that it had been destroyed. Bellatrix may have made the same assumptions or been told outright, but even if she hadn’t been told that the locket was a Horcrux, she knew it was something very special (Slytherin’s own locket) and that Voldemort wanted it well protected.

This one proposes that Bellatrix was given the Slytherin locket to hide in the sea cave for Voldemort, but she’s such a braggart she had to stop at 12 Grimmauld Place first to show it to fellow Death Eater and cousin Regulus to prove that she was Voldemort’s favorite and most trusted disciple. Regulus, a disaffected Death Eater and blood purist, was planning to leave Voldemort after realizing he had gotten in over his head; furthermore, Regulus may have realized that Voldemort was a half-blood, which would have given him another reason to want to leave the Death Eaters.

Regulus, guessing that the locket was a Horcrux, perhaps based on Voldemort’s inhuman appearance, switched the Slytherin locket (possibly putting a confundus spell on Bellatrix) with the gold locket containing his note to Voldemort. Bellatrix placed Regulus’s locket in the basin in the middle of the sea cave and covered it with poison. Regulus was murdered soon after, leaving Slytherin’s locket behind at 12 Grimmauld Place. This would be the heavy gold locket that no one could open.

The timing would be right since Lucius was given the diary shortly before Voldemort disappeared in 1981 (not known how long before). Regulus died in 1979 IIRC, so it's plausible that Regulus switched the lockets shortly before he was killed for being a deserter.

The theory:

1) Explains why the fake locket was at the bottom of the basin covered in the full basin of poison, apparently undisturbed, and
2) Eliminates the problem of explaining how one person could have managed to cross in the boat to drink the poison and then get out while managing to replace the poison and then get out without tipping off Voldemort

Supporting evidence:

1) The note from RAB claiming to have discovered Voldemort’s secret (possibly his half-bloodedness and definitely his Horcrux)
2) What might be a hint from Bellatrix: “The Dark Lord has, in the past, entrusted me with his most precious—if Lucius hadn’t—“ HBP2.
3) Voldemort gave the diary to Lucius for safekeeping, so there is no reason he wouldn’t have given the locket Horcrux to Bellatrix to hide in that sea cave.

Someone named David Camillus came up with it (http://www.mugglenet.com/editorials/editorials/edit-dcamillus01.shtml) and someone named Professor Mum worked on it some more (http://professor-mum.livejournal.com/4469.html).

It does make some sense because we know that Voldemort has giving away at least one of his horcrux. The diary went to Lucius for safe keeping, even though he only thought it was suppose to open the chamber. So if he gave one to Bella to hide that would make some sense. What if Bella wasn't given the locket, what if the real locket really went to R.A.B and Bella got another horcrux maybe the Hufflepff cup?

Could the "precious" Bellatrix is referring to, be the Diary? given to her by LV and that she knew what it really contained? Her "if Lucius had'nt.." be refering to him as having used the Diary while she was in Azkaban? Which may explain why she refered herself as LV most trusted and loyal DE. Though come to think of it ,as she is completly deranged (more so than before she entered Azkaban) it could be something completly innocent!

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Yes, I have to agree that a face off between Snape and Bellatrix would be amazing. However I believe that Snape would triumph. Bella is an amazingly strong character, but her extreme devotion to LV would be her downfall. She shrieks and goes almost insane when Harry merely says LV and when he purposely winds her up she takes the bait and goes mad. Snape being as slippery and cunning as he is would easily push Bellatrix's buttons and make her loose her cool, where Snape could stay cool and finish her. Hopefully he doesnt though I LOVE BELLA! SO DELICIOUSLY EVIL!

YOU CANT BEAT HER SCENE WITH NEVILLE IN THE DEPARTMENT OF MYSTERIES, WHEN SHE LEARNS HIS LAST NAME!! " Why, I have had the pleasure of meeting your parents,boy" BRILLIANT!

Or could Bellatrix just be generalizing? I mean she could be telling Snape in general that LV trusted her with his more important tasks? I don't necessarily think it is a specific item/task.

The idea that bellatrix hid the locket on the instructions of Voldermort doesn't seem to work. When he and Harry are in the cave, dumbledore claims that he taught Voldermort and knows his style, in reference to a question of Harry's. This seems to idicate that Voldermort himself hid the locket in the basin in the cave.

It's a pity as the theory was really growing on me.

it could be knowledge... if Bellatrix knows of his knowledge of the horocrux's...

I know what the 'Precious' is - the golden Ring of Power.
I'm just goofing around.
I think she means his most precious secrets but she is wrong because LV never confided in her that he was a half blood since she gets so worked up when Harry tells her at the MoM

A problem I have with that theory:

Why would Lord Voldemort tell her about something as personal as the cave where he went when he was a boy? He is very secretive about his past. That hiding place is too personal for any but Voldemort to known about it, I would guess.

The Book was a Horcrux and therefore important. She did not know what it was only the dark lord wanted it not to be used for any reason. When Malfoy got ahold of the book he used it for personal gain. No Death Eater knows about the Horcrux's, except maybe Snape.

Quote: When I first read this I did wonder if she was referring to a Horcrux but I can't really see LV broadcasting to ANYONE that he has made Horcruxes let alone let them know if they have one in their possesion.

Well he wouldn't but he may have made an exception to one of his most trusted DE's.

What if she was just talking? She could've been just trying to sound like he really trust her. Most of the Death Eaters probably claim to b his most loyal and his favorite.

I seem to remember Dumbledore saying Lucius didn't actually know what the diary was. Maybe none of the death-eaters actually know about the horcruxes.

I think it may have been something more like a duty she had.

If it was a horcrux, then she probablly didn't know what it was.

~*~ RockinRavenclaw ~*~